Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 15:24:02 -0700 (MST) From: GROSSINGER ROY HELMUT Subject: Plans and Insurance I had a wonderful X-Mas present, I received plans; #503. Since Nat published only 503 first edition plans, I believe I've received one of the first second edition plans. I have yet to compare them with the first edition, but the major changes are that I only need to update the plans from Newsletter #52. From what I hear I'm not going to miss much. I also wish to send out a question. I've had the unpleasant exp. of having a house burn to the ground. How do you cover the Cozy while in production? How do you determine the loss in $? State Farm looked at me like I was some kind of a nut when I told him what I was doing. ROY, #503 Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 22:15:10 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Walsh Subject: Re: Plans and Insurance The production process takes a while and Avemco will issue insurance on the plane during building as long as the value is in excess of $2000.00 The premiums are very reasonable, But you have to have the $2000.00 value first. They won't lookat you funny either!!! Bill W Date: Mon, 8 Jan 1996 08:29:33 -0500 From: Phillip.Johnson@Lockheed.on.ca (Phillip Johnson) Subject: Re: Plans and Insurance Roy Grossinger Writes: > I've had the unpleasant exp. of having a house burn to the ground. > How do you cover the Cozy while in production? Avemco have such a policy. A friend of mine had his Velocity burned by an arsonist. Avemco paid both material in full and estimated labour at $30/hr (Canadian dollars). You need to keep some sort of log to validate the hours and remember the log should not be kept in the house in case the log goes up in flames as well. Phillip Johnson Date: Thu, 11 Jan 1996 05:36:00 -0500 (EST) From: Rick Crapse Subject: Re: Plans and Insurance There is such a thing as hull insurance. Sorry bill if you get two copies of this but I'm kind of patched through 3 systems for this message and cut and paste are not exactly talking to eash other. Anyway, some of the av insurance groups offer hull insurance. I believe the EAA also offers it to memebers. Rick Crapse Cozy #705 (i'm legal now(my project has been through at least 8 previous owners before me....It's traveled more miles without wings,gear, engine, or prop than it took to go get it..I wonder what the conversion to TT airframe is??) Does this also count as frequent flier maintenance miles or just airframe static testing? Uhaul and me a potent flyers dream*sarcasm*. From: "Steve Campbell" Subject: COZY: Insurance Date: Wed, 6 Nov 1996 16:23:46 >>Howard asked about insurance. I don't think any carrier will insure a >>first flight, or for the test period. I could not get my Long-EZ >>insured (liability only) until I had flown off my test period, which is >>25 to 50 hours long, depending on what your FAA rep assigns you. Ken Brimmer writes > You will find that they will insure you after the first 10 hours. I believe that Avemco will insure the first flight if you participate in the EAA flight advisor and get 3 visits during the building process from an EAA tech consulor. This is from memory so I could be wrong, but I thought that was the big announcement that EAA made when the program was started a couple of years back. Steve **************************************** Stephen A. Campbell Associate Professor, EE University of Minnesota ***************************************** by SERV05.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IBIWMR9KQ8000W9Z@SERV05.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for cozy_builders@hpwarhw.an.hp.com; Wed, 06 Nov 1996 12:00:31 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 12:00:58 -0700 From: hrogers@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Howard Rogers) Subject: COZY: Insurance for Soob-power Hi, guys. I have a question to those of you who are currently flying behind (or in front of) a Soob engine. I'm asking on behalf of a friend who has ordered a Stewart S-51 that will be powered by a big automotive-derived v-8. He is currently shopping for insurance, both for the building perion, and for in-flight coverage. Avemco has told him that they do not want to insure any "automotive powered aircraft". He is still looking. What are your experiences with insurers, good or bad? For example, will ANY of them insure a first flight? If not, how about in-flight coverage later (after n hours have been accumulated, for instance). Any info would be appreciated. Thanks. --Howard Rogers, 415-926-4052 hrogers@slac.stanford.edu Date: Wed, 06 Nov 1996 15:39:21 -0500 From: Mahan Subject: COZY: Insurance Howard asked about insurance. I don't think any carrier will insure a first flight, or for the test period. I could not get my Long-EZ insured (liability only) until I had flown off my test period, which is 25 to 50 hours long, depending on what your FAA rep assigns you. After that AVEMCO was happy to insure me for a reasonable rate. If you're flying an aircraft with which an insurer has no experience, it'll probably be harder to get coverage. Also, they're probably going to be happier and charge less if a homebuilt has an aircraft engine than if it has an automotive conversion. I don't carry hull insurance because it would cost thousands of dollars per year, and if I break a wing, I'm the guy who has to build a new one anyway, right? IMHO, an aluminum Stewart F-51 with a big automotive V-8 conversion is going to be an extremely expensive aircraft to insure -- the fast-build kit alone, sans engine, is about $80,000. Fred in Florida Date: 07 Nov 96 01:24:48 EST From: INFINITY Aerospace <72124.347@compuserve.com> Subject: COZY: Sport Aircraft Insurance Hi to All, A builder can rarely get insurance from any insurance company for any Experimental Amatuer-Built Homebuilt for the first 10 hours and / or 10 landings, no matter what enigne is used. As for any type of insurance, premiums and coverage after the first 10 hours and / or 10 landings, the type of insurance, premiums and coverage available is based on your pilot experience and hours in type and models flown over how many years, current / latest experience, model and type of aircraft you are building and it's track record, and it's engine type and maybe propellor. Statistically, as you all may know, many / most Sport Aircraft accidents happen within the first 40 hours. After this first 40 hours, Sport Aircraft usually have as safe, or safer, track record than the production spam cans. Also, builders usually find out that by 100 hours, most all of the little quirks will be found out about their pride and joy. Info: Production aircraft brokers / agents / buyers rarely buy an aircraft with a "new" engine until this "new" engine has at least 100 hours. Any problems with this "new" engine usually manifests itself by then. The FAA relies heavily upon the EAA Technical Counselors in the United States who do the visits prior to final inspection by them. In fact, the Advisory Circular AC 20-27D covers this in detail. AVEMCO, in cooperation with EAA National's Technical Counselor and EAA Flight Advisor programs, will insure a Sport Aircraft (I don't like to use the negative connotation terms above for "Joe and Jane Public" goes nuts when they hear the term(s) Experimental, Homebuilt, etc.) if a builder works with both an EAA Technical Councelor and EAA Flight Advisor during the building of, and prior to first flight, of their project. In fact, EAA and AVEMCO Insurance have a program where a builder of Sport Aircraft can get a discount on his premium costs when having his aircraft inspected by an EAA Tecnical Counselor at least 3 times. If you get inspections by your EAA Tecnical Counselor at least 3 times and work with your EAA Flight Advisor before first flight, you should even be able to get full coverage for the first 10 hours and / or 10 landings. Check with your local EAA to find out who your Technical Councelor(s) and EAA Flight Advisor(s) are. HTH. P.S. - What's everyone think of yesterday's "Black Tuesday"? Infinity's Forever, EAA Member EAA Technical Counselor JD EAA Flight Advisor AOPA Member Test Pilot James D. Newman, President LCDR F-14 USNR INFINITY Aerospace Mailing Address: P. O. Box 12275 El Cajon, CA 92022 Shipping Address: 1750 Joe Crosson Drive, D-2 El Cajon, CA 92020 (619) 448-5103 PH & FAX 72124.347@compuserve.com Home Page http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/INFINITY_Aerospace