Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 19:51:56 -0500 From: PBurkha238@aol.com Subject: oil cooler installation gentleman, I'm getting ready to install my oil cooler and am concerned about the installation (large hole in cowling) I'm wondering if there has been a better mouse trap in this area. I like the idea about having the cowling area/engine cool down via this method, but am looking for alternatives prior to commitment. Paul Burkhardt Date: Tue, 2 Apr 1996 19:51:56 -0500 From: PBurkha238@aol.com Subject: carb/throttle body temp probe cozy folks, I'm installing an ellison and am also going to use the Rocky Mountain Insturment micro monitor, One of the options is to use a carb temp probe that can be installed in the throttle body. The only problem is that there is no port to install it. Which means having a hole machined in the side of it. The Rocky people said to try and get it as close to the plenum as possible and on the open/idle side. Has anyone had any experience in this area. Paul Burkhardt Date: Wed, 3 Apr 1996 18:15:47 -0500 From: RonKidd@aol.com Subject: Re: oil cooler installation I had mine "down" for 300 hours. All with oil temps above 200 degrees (240 in a hard climb, Ouch!) . I reversed it using an intake scoop under the cowl and an exit ramp on top of the cowl and cut 20 degrees from my oil temps. I can't imagine why we would defy the laws of thermodynamics by trying to cool in a downward direction! Ron Kidd, Cozy N417CZ Date: Thu, 04 Apr 1996 07:56:17 From: JRaerocad@gnn.com (Jeff Russell) Subject: Re: oil cooler installation Ron Kidd writes: > I had mine "down" for 300 hours. All with oil temps above 200 > degrees (240 in a hard climb, Ouch!) . I reversed it using an > intake scoop under the cowl and an exit ramp on top of the cowl > and cut 20 degrees from my oil temps. I can't imagine why we > would defy the laws of thermodynamics by trying to cool in a > downward direction! The Velocitys all put the oil cooler in the nose of the airplane. This is done for a CG issue and for a heater in the winter. The two things I disliked about this system was the long oil lines and the possibility of an oil cooler failure in the nose. I still installed my oil cooler in the nose of our AeroCanard because of the first two reasons Velocity used. Oil pressure drops from 80 psi to about 65-70 in the summer time because of the long 1/2" lines to the nose and back. I have no problem heating the cockpit in 10-20 degree weather, but did with the other system in the Cozy 3, even with a blower forcing it up to the nose. A lot of the Velocitys still had oil temp problems because they also vented out the bottom of the airplane. I know that heat rises and when sitting on the ground I wanted a chimney affect. My Cozy with the vent on the Btm Cowl would start heating up as long as I sat on the ground with the engine running. When time to take off, GESS WHAT?? I was at 200 deg. after waiting in line 30 min. to leave. This seem to happen a lot at bigger airports. I wanted for this never to happen again on the next airplane I built. Instead of installing the vent on the side or bottom, I used the nose door for the top vent. Works great. There was to much STUFF on the NG-30's, so the rudder pedals needed to be changed from the plans to lay down master cylinders. That mod. really clean up the nose. I used 2 large Velocity NACA scoops to feed the cooler with a duck going to the nose door. Velocity only uses one NACA and I found that I only needed one also. I taped one off in flight and it cooled the same. The highest my oil temps in the (summer 100 deg) was 220 max. PS. the two NACA's act as handles to move the airplane about. I not saying that's this is the best system or the best for speed, But I like it. AeroCad Inc. Jeff Russell 1445 Crater Lane Yadkinville, NC. 27055 910-961-2238 E-mail: JRaerocad@gnn.com Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 09:49:19 -0500 From: Marcnadine@aol.com Subject: Re: oil cooler installation (Jeff Russell) writes: >The Velocitys all put the oil cooler in the nose of the airplane. > I used 2 large Velocity NACA scoops to feed >the cooler with a duck going to the nose door. Velocity only uses one >NACA and I found that I only needed one also. I taped one off in flight >and it cooled the same. The highest my oil temps in the (summer 100 deg) >was 220 max. I was talking with Vance Atkinson the other night about putting my oil cooler up front and he had some interesting things to say about the installation. First he has a friend that is flying a Velocity and is having problems cooling the oil. He did agree that venting out the top of the nose would help, but did not care for the look. He also mentioned the weight of large oil cooler in the nose may be a problem. One of the fixes that Vance thinks may work if puting a small oil cooler in the nose (feeding it first) and also putting a second one in the back in the engine area. He feels this should keep the engine cool and keep the nose lighter. I spoke with Velocity this week and found out that they will sell you the NACA scoop and oil cooler housing (made for the full size oil cooler, and vents to the nose bottom) for $100. After also talking to Jeff Russell at Aerocad I decided to order Jeff's NACA scoop and build my own housing to hold a small cooler and vent out the bottom. Hope it works. Marc N425CZ From: "Dewey Davis" Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 10:16:02 -0500 Subject: Re: oil cooler installation On Apr 4, 9:49, Marcnadine@aol.com wrote: > Subject: Re: oil cooler installation > > I was talking with Vance Atkinson the other night about putting my oil cooler > up front and he had > some interesting things to say about the installation. First he has a friend > that is flying a Velocity > and is having problems cooling the oil. I happened to be talking with Vance last night and he told me something very similar about the Velocity oil cooling arrangement. We have a couple of local Velocity builders and they love the front mounted oil cooler. They say the engine runs cool and the heater runs hot! But Vance relates several other instances where it didn't work out so well. It probably is related to the air exit configuration. BTW, Vance flew into Washington Dulles last night, and June and I had dinner with him. He gave us a tour of the brand new Learjet 60 he is flying with his new job. What a machine. The Glass cockpit in that jet is very impressive. Very sharp, color displays of everything from gyros to TCAS alerts. Makes me want to go out and redo my panel! Dewey From: Ken Reiter Date: Tue, 7 May 96 12:24:11 CDT Subject: COZY: LR-2/LR-3 B&C Linear Regulator for Alternator Hello To All, I am working on the engine install and wiring for my Cozy. Presently, I am going to use a auto alternator with a B&C Linear Regulator - So I thought that I would ask if any of you has a used B&C regulator that they want to sell before I purchase a new one. Thank You, Ken Reiter Date: Tue, 07 May 96 15:40:37 EST From: MISTER@neesnet.com Subject: Re: COZY: LR-2/LR-3 B&C Linear Regulator for Alternator Ken Reiter wrote: "I am working on the engine install and wiring for my Cozy. Presently, I am going to use a auto alternator with a B&C Linear Regulator - So I thought that I would ask if any of you has a used B&C regulator that they want to sell before I purchase a new one." First question. Have you got your alternator yet? I had planned to use an alternator without an internal regulator. I had a lot of trouble finding a nice lightweight automotive unit. I ended up getting a neat auto unit with an internal regulator. I added a homemade external overvoltage crowbar. A friend with a longeze has been running a like unit for over 500 hours with nary a problem. While I would have preferred an external regulator that I could adjust, the opportunity was too good to pass up. I do have a Bob Nuckolls solid state regulator ("Ford" type) with built in crow bar that I'd be willing to part with if you're interested. The linear regulator while a neat idea was too pricey for me. Bob Misterka N342RM Date: Sun, 2 Jun 1996 05:54:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Randy Crutfield Subject: COZY: Engine Cooling Has anyone tried used small box fans (muffin fans) to force air through the oil cooler to aid in engine cooling during ground operations? Seems like a good idea to me. Looks like two of them would fit side-by-side on the oil cooler. I know from blowing dust out of electronic gear that they will turn freely with no power applied, so if they are turned off prior to take off the normal flow of cooling air in flight should not be impaired and the fan should not be damaged. Randy Date: Sun, 2 Jun 1996 13:26:35 -0400 From: CCady@aol.com Subject: Re: COZY: Engine Cooling In a message dated 96-06-02 06:00:58 EDT, you write: >Has anyone tried used small box fans (muffin fans) to force air through >the oil cooler to aid in engine cooling during ground operations? >Seems like a good idea to me. Yes I have two of them installed just as you describe. I don't notice a huge difference in the air but I figure that on the ground it's got to help. It gets pretty hot here in Florida in the summer! Date: 17 Sep 96 00:54:23 EDT From: Rick Roberts <102503.1561@compuserve.com> Subject: COZY: Engine Center Line Versus Dynafocal mount Hi everybody, I am trying to fabricate my engine mount for my 540 and I need to know some data for the 320/360. Namely what is the vertical relationship of the mounting bolts to the center of the crankshaft? For instance on my engine the upper mounts are located 6.5712" (lycoming's number) above the crank centerline and the lower mounts are located at 10.0212" below the center line. Please let me know ASAP, I'm on hold until I can dig up this info. Thanks, Rick Date: Tue, 17 Sep 1996 09:38:22 -0400 From: wilhelmson@scra.org Subject: Re: COZY: Engine Center Line Versus Dynafocal mount RICK: About six months ago I did a force diagram on two engine mounts for a 540 in a MKIV. The numbers you want were provided by the builder to me as 16.4 vertically between the dynafocal mount holes with the thrust line 1.2 inches above the center. The dynafocal mount angles were determined to be 20 degrees in a plane through the center line (not the thrust line) and the mount hole center. I have two force diagrams, one for a mount designed to be extremely close to the firewall and using electronic ignition. The other one is for using standard mags and is farther away. Since I did this work as a favor to the other builder I can do what I want with it. If you want CAD files or paper drawings let me know what file format or fax number to send them to. Date: 22 Oct 96 14:58:57 EDT From: Rick Roberts <102503.1561@compuserve.com> Subject: COZY: Exhaust systems Hi I am in the process of designing/inprocess building of the exhaust system for my O-540. Does anyone know of a good source of info on the best way and the requirements for a successful exhaust system?? Thanks, Rick Roberts Date: Thu, 7 Nov 1996 18:17:44 -0600 From: mbeduhn@mail.snider.net (Mark Beduhn) Subject: COZY: Electronic Ignition I am planning on installing an electronic ignition in the place of one of the mags on the O-360 I just bought. The only system I can find is the one carried by Aircraft Spruce. Does anyone have a recommendation? Model numbers, prices and phone numbers would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Mark Beduhn Cozy MK IV # 494 Airframe complete except for strakes (my neighbors finally figured out that I'm not building a boat in my shop). Plan to mount engine in January '97. by SERV05.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (PMDF V5.0-6 #10979) id <01IBLH8R2LWO0010VA@SERV05.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> for cozy_builders@hpwarhw.an.hp.com; Fri, 08 Nov 1996 08:12:29 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 08:13:01 -0700 From: hrogers@SLAC.Stanford.EDU (Howard Rogers) Subject: COZY: Electronic Ignition >I am planning on installing an electronic ignition in the place of one of >the mags on the O-360 I just bought. The only system I can find is the one >carried by Aircraft Spruce. Does anyone have a recommendation? Model >numbers, prices and phone numbers would be greatly appreciated. >Thanks >Mark Beduhn Mark, I don't have the phone number with me, but if you look in the ads section of Sport Aviation or Kitplanes, you will find the ad for Klaus Savier's system. Look for "Lightspeed". There are others, as well. I believe one of the Magneto makers (Slick?) is marketing an electronic ignition now, also. Lightspeed's system is not cheap, but it is incredibly good. --Howard Rogers, 415-926-4052 hrogers@slac.stanford.edu Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 11:49:16 -0500 From: Mahan Subject: COZY: Electronic Ignition Don't buy an electronic ingition unit, or anything else electrical, until you are ready to use it. More and cheaper electronic ignition units (and radios, GPS units, etc.) are appearing on the market all the time. If you buy something too soon, you may be unhappy with its shortcomings later when lots of better or cheaper units of the same thing are available and you're not yet flying. Leave that money in the bank, or buy things now that don't change, like airspeed indicators, artificial horizons, engines (but prep it for storage), or wheel/brake sets. These things don't change, and just keep getting more expensive. Fred in Florida Date: Fri, 08 Nov 1996 11:54:37 -0800 From: berkut@loop.com Subject: Re: COZY: Electronic Ignition Mahan@digital.net wrote >Don't buy an electronic ingition unit, or anything else electrical, >until you are ready to use it. More and cheaper electronic ignition >units (and radios, GPS units, etc.) are appearing on the market all the >time. Absolutely true. Klaus Savier has _just_ released a new version of his ignition unit, and I'm stuck with the one I bought 6 months ago. Probably 6 more months till my plane flies, too. -- Czech Sikhs! Richard Riley "The important things are always simple. The simple things are always hard." See the Berkut at http://www.berkut.com From: "James E. Marker" Subject: Re: COZY: Electronic Ignition Date: Fri, 8 Nov 1996 15:04:12 -0500 > From: Mark Beduhn <> > I am planning on installing an electronic ignition in the place of one of > the mags on the O-360 I just bought. <> I know of three sources: 1) Lightspeed - http://www.berkut.com/lightsp/kindex.htm. 2) Control Vision Corporation - http://www.controlvision.com/index.htm 1-800-292-1160 3) Unison Lasar - no address, no phone number. See Flying Magazine November 1996, Page 44. Recently STC'd for Cessna 172's with IO-320s, but ok'd for 360's and 320's. ========================================================================== Jim Marker - jemstone@csra.net - http://www.csra.net/jemstone Dad of Jacob (May 94), Kassidy, Zachary, Skyler (Triplets - Nov 95). University of Illinois - Nuclear Engineering 1990 Desert Shield/Storm Vet - XVIII Airborne Corps - Dragon Brigade COZY Mark IV - Serial Number 0581 - Building Chapter 3. Date: Mon, 11 Nov 96 19:16 EET From: edegov@aztec.co.za (ernie de goveia) Subject: COZY: Re COZY Electronic Ignition Hi all Vance Atkinson described, in an article in Kit planes Sept 92, the fitting of electronic ignition to his cozy. He used an Electronic unit manufactured by Jeff Rose of Electro Air at phone, then 615/622-8825. Nat wrote in a news letter soon after, that Vance had dual electronic ignition on his airplane. Bob Nuckolls of the AeroElectric Connection, 6936 Bainbridge Rd, Wichita KS67226-1008. Wrote in Sport Aviation of Jan 94, Aug 95 and Dec 95 about a system controlling two batteries for dual electronic ignition, this may be worth checking out. Finally I think mags should be relegated to the past, what do you all think? Ernie de Goveia Cozy3 Ch 11 From: Lee Devlin Subject: COZY: Electronic Ignitions Date: Wed, 20 Nov 1996 11:10:12 MST I remember reading a posting recently by someone who wanted to gather data on the available electronic ignition systems. I was also thinking about a unit for my LongEZ, primarily for easier starting and better reliability. I intend to keep one mag as a backup. Here's some information I've found so far: Jeff Rose (423) 622-8825 of Electroair offers a system for $780 that is known for its ease of installation. He has several of his systems installed in planes that have achieved world altitude records. There are several in Rutan's Boomerang and he has sold a total of about 700 units to date. Klaus Savier (805) 933-3299 of Lightspeed Engineering offers a CDI based system for $980 which is easier to install than his previous systems and I believe he's working on one that will be even easier to install by just replacing the mag. Klaus doesn't believe in using coils to store energy claiming that they tend to get very hot and instead uses a capacitive discharge approach. He has discontinued offering his lower-cost transistor (coil) ignition and lowered the price on his CDI so that it is not as costly as it was a few years ago. Perhaps it's a response to some of the competitive pressures. I have heard many good things about both Jeff Rose and Klaus Savier. Ed Chanik of Empire Development (http://members.aol.com/chanik/ed/index.htm) offers a microprocessor-based unit with the following description: Electronic Ignition System: This is a fully variable, Hall-effect based, distributor-less ignition system with multi-spark drive, 100-mJoule output energy, over-rev cutoff, built in manifold-pressure sensor and/or RPM indicator. The unit is optimized for use on 4-cylinder Lycoming, Continental and Franklin engines. Average current draw is 1.5 Amps at +13.8 VDC. The unit also doubles as a low-cost manifold pressure display. Spark advance is from 50 to 5 degrees BTDC. This is the smallest, lightest, easiest installing system of its kind anywhere. $385.00 including two dual output coils, four spark plugs, two trigger magnets, controller, MOSFET output module, display LED and display select toggle switch. Deluxe version includes an integral knock sensor to provide individual cylinder spark retard in the event of detonation/pre-ignition as well as a pilot warning display. Add $95.00 (Stand-alone knock sensor and warning light also available separately for $99.00) Plug inserts for use with common 14mm 3/4" reach automotive plugs are $39.95 per set of 4. I don't know much about the above system except that it's about half the price of the other guys' systems but the installation looks somewhat difficult. To reach his homepage and read the owner's manual and an interesting article about electronic ignitions, see: http://members.aol.com/chanik/ed/index.htm The ease of installation seems to be a big deal with some of the people I've talked with. If the installation includes measuring angles and gluing magnets on flywheels and adding bracketry for hall effect sensors, it is stands to reason that it will be more involved than simply replacing a mag. I intend to continue researching this topic so if anyone has more information regarding electronic ignitions, please respond to this note. I did look through Marc's archives, but found no references to electronic ignitions in places I expected to find them. Lee Devlin | HP Greeley Division | Long EZ N36MX Piper Colt N4986Z | 700 71st Ave. | Cozy MK IV under const. 'Spirit of rec.aviation'| Greeley, CO 80634 | (Chapter 10) Date: Sun, 01 Dec 1996 17:46:52 -0500 From: Paul Burkhardt Subject: COZY: CHT/EGT probes Does anyone have a source for CHT/EGT probes? I saw a company at Oshkosh that sold new ones, they seemed to be of limited length and didnt seem quite long enough to meet the firewall. which is where I would like to have them reach. Paul Burkhardt Date: Sat, 7 Dec 1996 15:53:48 -0500 From: KSPREUER@aol.com Subject: Re: COZY: Prop Extensions? In a message dated 96-10-17 08:59:56 EDT, you write: << There are several tradeoffs to consider. Generally, you want the longest extension you can get in order to improve prop efficiency (get it further from the dirty air) and reduce prop noise. But the longer the extension, the larger the stress on the crank, especially if you intend to do high g maneuvers. One clarifiying point, the crank shaft stresses would only increase by the term due to the weight of the prop times the loadfactor. This term is insignificant compared to the moment term resulting from high G maneuvers and their associated pitch rates (gyroscopic forces). This term is independant of the length of the prop extension. Ex-Helicopter Dynamics Engineer Subject: COZY: Engine mount sources From: mbeduhn@juno.com (Mark W Beduhn) Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 19:31:43 EST I am going to purchase a motor mount for my O-360 within the next few weeks. Is Brock the only place I can get one, or is there another manufacturer that someone would recommend? Mark Beduhn Cozy MK IV #494 Date: Thu, 12 Dec 1996 20:24:01 -0500 From: Westlande@aol.com Subject: Re: COZY: Engine mount sources In a message dated 12/12/96 4:36:31 PM, mbeduhn@juno.com (Mark W Beduhn) wrote: >I am going to purchase a motor mount for my O-360 within the next few >weeks. Is Brock the only place I can get one, or is there another >manufacturer that someone would recommend? > >Mark Beduhn >Cozy MK IV #494 Mark, Jeff Rusell makes mounts, I'll let speak to the deatils as I am not sure of them . I also sent a letter off this week to Weld Tech. They have supplied mounts for other builders and I am told they are first rate. However, they are not answering their phone, so if no one else has current info to post, I will post what I get in the mail. -eric Date: 15 Dec 96 23:17:31 EST From: "Edmond A. Richards" <103235.1336@compuserve.com> Subject: COZY: Remote Oil Filter Greetings All, I remember seeing at least one reference in this forum to a remote mounted oil filter. I am about ready to install my engine and find it will be nearly impossible to change the oil filter without pulling the engine each time. The only unit I am familiar with is the AIRWOLF as shown in the Aircraft Spruce catalog. If there is a better alternative I would be interested to hear about it. Any comments or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. BTW thanks Marc for all the work on setting up the forum, its a great way to exchange information and I believe we have all benefited from the interaction. I know it would not be possible without your efforts. Thanks again! Happy Holidays Ed Richards Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 01:23:53 -0500 From: Westlande@aol.com Subject: Re: COZY: Remote Oil Filter In a message dated 12/15/96 8:23:59 PM, 103235.1336@compuserve.com (Edmond A. Richards) wrote: > >I remember seeing at least one reference in this forum to a remote mounted oil >filter. I am about ready to install my engine and find it will be nearly >impossible to change the oil filter without pulling the engine each time. The >only unit I am familiar with is the AIRWOLF as shown in the Aircraft Spruce >catalog. If there is a better alternative I would be interested to hear about >it. Any comments or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. I have a friend that just installed the new B&C unit on his Long EZ. I think it was about $250. While I have not seen it yet, he tells me it's great. It is not a "remote" unit, but makes changing the filter much easier (he had the oil screen previously). -eric westland Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 08:22:02 From: JRaerocad@gnn.com (Jeff Russell) Subject: Re: COZY: Remote Oil Filter "Edmond A. Richards"wrote: >If there is a better alternative I would be interested >to hear about it. Any comments or suggestions would be greatly >appreciated. I use a NAPA oil filter part #1351. It is stort and stubby. I safety it using a stainless hose clamp and safety wire. It fits with no problem. AeroCad Inc. Jeff Russell 1445 Crater Lane Yadkinville, NC. 27055 phone/fax 910-961-2238 E-mail: JRaerocad@gnn.com NEW homepage address: http://www.binary.net/aerocad Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 19:19:39 -0500 From: Paul Burkhardt Subject: COZY: oil filter housing >If there is a better alternative I would be interested to hear about I just bought the B and C unit and the cost was 350.00. Its nicely made and fit nicely. You will have to off-set your oil cooler off center a bit however. Paul Burkhardt Date: Mon, 16 Dec 1996 20:44:45 -0500 (EST) From: "D. L. Davis" Subject: Re: COZY: oil filter housing At 07:19 PM 12/16/96 -0500, Paul Burkhardt wrote: >>If there is a better alternative I would be interested to hear >about >I just bought the B and C unit and the cost was 350.00. Its nicely made >and fit nicely. You will have to off-set your oil cooler off center a >bit however. Paul Burkhardt > I spoke to Bill Bainbridge at Oshkosh about this new unit. He was showing off the first production unit at that time. I think this is a real good idea, to have the oil filter mount directly on the accessory case without needing any other expensive hoses or sources of leaks. I think Jim Price tried it first on his Long EZ and Bill has now taken it into production. Just this weekend I saw Bill again at the 10 year anniversary celebration of the Voyager flight at the Smithsonian. (A wonderful event BTW, Burt and Dick Rutan, Jeanna Yeager, John Roncz, and many others were there. They related some of the behind the scenes stories of the flight. Truly a remarkable event). Anyway, Bill said that he has further refined the design and it looks even better now with the gold alodine finish. But if you want one, order it before the end of the year! He said the price is going up to $399 after the holidays. When you consider the Airwolf unit costs $500, plus another $100 or so for hoses, the B&C unit is a real good deal. And it weighs less and should be more reliable to boot! I think you can get it now for $349. Dewey Davis Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 10:33:34 -0500 (EST) From: Kenneth Brimmer Subject: Re: COZY: oil filter housing At 08:44 PM 12/16/96 -0500, you wrote: >At 07:19 PM 12/16/96 -0500, Paul Burkhardt wrote: >>>If there is a better alternative I would be interested to hear >>about >>I just bought the B and C unit and the cost was 350.00. Its nicely made >>and fit nicely. You will have to off-set your oil cooler off center a >>bit however. Paul Burkhardt >> Dewey said: .......... But if you want one, >order it before the end of the year! He said the price is going up to $399 >after the holidays. When you consider the Airwolf unit costs $500, plus >another $100 or so for hoses, the B&C unit is a real good deal. And it >weighs less and should be more reliable to boot! I think you can get it now >for $349. > > Dewey Davis I have been using an auto filter for close to 400 hrs. with no problem and no sign of problem so I really think that the auto filter is the cheapest and lightest way to go. I think Jeff Russel is also using them. Both the automotive and the aircraft filters are tested to 300psi so with the clamp around the outside of the filter (for safety wireing) I believe you have a very safe system. Ken Brimmer brimmer@erols.com "It's easy to build a plane that will last a life time." - Stolen Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 15:08:13 -0500 From: DFinn7971@aol.com Subject: Re: COZY: oil filter housing In a message dated 96-12-17 10:38:05 EST, brimmer@pop.erols.com (Kenneth Brimmer) writes: << with the clamp around the outside of the filter (for safety wireing) I believe you have a very safe system. >> I am having a hard time picturing how this is done. What kind of clamp is used and how is it safety wired. Also, several years ago a friend who is a mechanic told me that there is a significant difference in the quality of filters available for cars. He actually handed me two identical Fram filters (except for the part number). One filter was noticibly heavier then the other. He told me he had cut one of the heavier ones open and found that it contained significantly more filter material. Apparently the heavier duty filters are available from auto part stores while the lighter duty ones are the filters you find on sale for $2.47 at K-mart. I don't know that the difference is worth considering if you plan to change the filters often. I've continued to install the cheaper ones on my cars but I always change at 2500 miles. In any case, it might be worth checking out the filters before installing on your $11,000 IO360. My $.02. Dick Finn Cozy Mark IV #46 DFINN7971@AOL.COM Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:00:17 -0500 From: Westlande@aol.com Subject: COZY: Decisions, Decisions... I have two engines available to me and can't decide which way to go. While I know there are always unknowns, I was wondering what others may feel is best to do. Of course, I would be happiest strapping on the mythical mid-time O-360 for $6,000, but they don't exist from what I can tell. For my Cozy 4-seater, one engine is a Lyc. O-320-D2J which came off a running Cessna when it got a 180 HP conversion. It is a first-run engine for $5,500. While there are no guarantees, it would probably have enough time left on it to do my initial flight testing. Anything more than that would be a bonus. I could then probably overhaul it well enough to last me many years for 6 or 8 thousand. A bonus is that these engines are economical to run and maintain, or so I am told. That all sounds fine, but on the minus side, there would be an increase in takeoff distances and a slight decrease in cruise speeds. The other engine is an IO-360-A3B6 with 1100 hours TTSN. It is off a Mooney that also went through a conversion. I can have it for $12,500. The plus is 200 HP which should get a fully loaded plane off the ground nicely (both using a fixed pitch prop). It should also last me years just as it is. The minuses are that it is about 50 pounds heavier than the O-320 and is more complex. The crank has counterweights (don't know if that is a plus or minus) and it has the dual mag, although I understand I can stick in a single mag and add an electronic ignition, something I was planning on anyways. The installation would be more complex including changing out the sump and shortening the induction tubes so it all fits in the cowl, but others have done it, I suppose I can as well. So, what to do??? Both engines have decent logs, no prop strike and have been properly stored. I think I could be happy with either, but would love to know what you would do. Thanks so much.. Eric Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:38:38 -0500 (EST) From: "D. L. Davis" Subject: Re: COZY: oil filter housing At 10:33 AM 12/17/96 -0500, Kenneth Brimmer wrote: >At 08:44 PM 12/16/96 -0500, you wrote: >>At 07:19 PM 12/16/96 -0500, Paul Burkhardt wrote: >>>>If there is a better alternative I would be interested to hear >>>about >>>I just bought the B and C unit and the cost was 350.00. Its nicely made >>>and fit nicely. You will have to off-set your oil cooler off center a >>>bit however. Paul Burkhardt >>> >Dewey said: > .......... But if you want one, >>order it before the end of the year! He said the price is going up to $399 >>after the holidays. When you consider the Airwolf unit costs $500, plus >>another $100 or so for hoses, the B&C unit is a real good deal. And it >>weighs less and should be more reliable to boot! I think you can get it now >>for $349. >> >> Dewey Davis >I have been using an auto filter for close to 400 hrs. with no problem and >no sign of problem so I really think that the auto filter is the cheapest >and lightest way to go. I think Jeff Russel is also using them. Both the >automotive and the aircraft filters are tested to 300psi so with the clamp >around the outside of the filter (for safety wireing) I believe you have a >very safe system. > Ken Brimmer > brimmer@erols.com >"It's easy to build a plane that will last a life time." - Stolen > > Ken, If you mean that we don't need any adapter at all, except the standard Lycoming oil filter adapter, then I would say it depends. In your case, with an O-235 installation, I think you have just that little bit of extra room between the firewall and the engine to fit a spin-on oil filter on the standard adapter. In my case, O-320, it won't fit at all. That's why the Price/Bainbridge adapter was built. It puts the filter at a right angle so it fits an EZ with the engine closer to the firewall. I did search around for a smaller profile automotive filter that might fit for me. But I didn't find one except for an obscure Renault filter, I believe. I bought one and considered trying it, but I chickened out because it looked considerably flimsier than a typical aircraft grade filter. The O-320-D2J runs at oil pressures exceeding 100 psi, quite a bit more than auto engines which are typically in the 30 psi range, I think. I don't remember the O-235 oil pressure but I think it is in the 60 to 80 psi range. So you might have a little more margin there than I do. But I suppose you could use an auto oil filter with either adapter. In that case, I would just make sure you have a good reliable one. If an oil filter bursts, you are going to be landing very soon! It sounds like you found one that is pressure tested to 300 psi, a good idea. Can't argue with 400 hours of demonstrated success. Dewey Date: Tue, 17 Dec 1996 20:43:17 -0500 (EST) From: "D. L. Davis" Subject: Re: COZY: Decisions, Decisions... At 08:00 PM 12/17/96 -0500, Westlande@aol.com wrote: >I have two engines available to me and can't decide which way to go. > >The other engine is an IO-360-A3B6 with 1100 hours TTSN. It is off a Mooney >So, what to do??? Both engines have decent logs, no prop strike and have >been properly stored. I think I could be happy with either, but would love >to know what you would do. > >Thanks so much.. > >Eric > You'd better grab the IO-360 before someone else does! Dewey Date: Wed, 18 Dec 1996 09:24:37 From: JRaerocad@gnn.com (Jeff Russell) Subject: Re: COZY: oil filter housing Dewey wrote: >Ken, > >If you mean that we don't need any adapter at all, except the >standard Lycoming oil filter adapter, then I would say it >depends. In your case, with an O-235 installation, I use a NAPA oil filter #1351 on a LIO-360-C1E6, it was short and stubby to give me room for removal. Burkut used this filter for 700+ hours and I have 100+. I change every 30 hours. AeroCad Inc. Jeff Russell 1445 Crater Lane Yadkinville, NC. 27055 phone/fax 910-961-2238 E-mail: JRaerocad@gnn.com NEW homepage address: http://www.binary.net/aerocad Date: Thu, 19 Dec 1996 20:12:06 -0500 From: Mahan Subject: Re: COZY: Decisions, Decisions... Westlande@aol.com wrote: > > I have two engines available to me and can't decide which way to go. While I > know there are always unknowns, I was wondering what others may feel is best > to do. Of course, I would be happiest strapping on the mythical mid-time > O-360 for $6,000, but they don't exist from what I can tell. > > For my Cozy 4-seater, one engine is a Lyc. O-320-D2J which came off a running > Cessna when it got a 180 HP conversion. It is a first-run engine for $5,500. > While there are no guarantees, it would probably have enough time left on it > to do my initial flight testing. Anything more than that would be a bonus. > I could then probably overhaul it well enough to last me many years for 6 or > 8 thousand. A bonus is that these engines are economical to run and maintain, > or so I am told. That all sounds fine, but on the minus side, there would be > an increase in takeoff distances and a slight decrease in cruise speeds. > > The other engine is an IO-360-A3B6 with 1100 hours TTSN. It is off a Mooney > that also went through a conversion. I can have it for $12,500. The plus is > 200 HP which should get a fully loaded plane off the ground nicely (both > using a fixed pitch prop). It should also last me years just as it is. The > minuses are that it is about 50 pounds heavier than the O-320 and is more > complex. The crank has counterweights (don't know if that is a plus or > minus) and it has the dual mag, although I understand I can stick in a single > mag and add an electronic ignition, something I was planning on anyways. The > installation would be more complex including changing out the sump and > shortening the induction tubes so it all fits in the cowl, but others have > done it, I suppose I can as well. > > So, what to do??? Both engines have decent logs, no prop strike and have > been properly stored. I think I could be happy with either, but would love > to know what you would do. > > Thanks so much.. > > Eric Eric, my suggestion would be ... neither. The 160 will have a lot of money tied up in it when you get through rebuilding it, even though it's initially cheap. If it had 1200 hours on it ... The 200 is heavier than a 180, although you wouldn't have any more money tied up in it than you would in the overhauled 160. I maintain that 200's have an inferior service record to 160's and 180's, but that thread has died out and I don't want to start a "urination competition." My concern would be driving that 200 hp through a wood prop hub/prop extention interface. EZ fliers never had problems driving 150/160 hp through a stock SAE #2 flange on a 4-8" long prop extension. When Rutan recommended up to 180 hp in the Defiant, he also recommended a special SAE #2 hub with the drive flange enlarged from 6" dia. to 7" dia. The friction between the flange and the prop hub, not the "drive lugs," drives the propellor. The extra 36% of area was needed because of the higher power of the 180 and its stronger power pulses. There was even a change in longer prop extensions a couple years ago because of the bigger power pulses twisting through them with the 180's. Now, to up the ante to 200 hp may put you into unknown territory. People have been flying 200 hp engines on Velocitys, so you'd have to talk to some of them to see what they're using for extensions and flanges. As soon as you buy the 160 or 200, a reasonably priced 180 will show up. If you're not about to fly, there's no rush to nail down an engine that isn't what you really want. I waited 1 1/2 years to get the second engine I wanted for my Defiant project. Wait. Fred in Florida Date: Mon, 23 Dec 96 11:03:23 EST From: MISTER@neesnet.com Subject: COZY: Throttle Quadrant Cable Does anyone know where I can get replacements for the sliding flexible steel cables in the COZY throttle quadrant that Brock sells? Someone told me that these are standard motorcycle throttle or brake cables. Can anyone shed any light on this? Happy Holidays to all! Bob Misterka N342RM Date: Mon, 23 Dec 1996 18:54:05 -0500 From: Paul Burkhardt Subject: COZY: Fuel line routing I was routing the fuel line that comes though the firewall yesterday and afterward realized that it could have probably been a little higher than I did it. So my question to the group is how high is too high. I would imagine that the upper limit would be just below the sump tubing inlet(from the strakes). The way it is now it seems that the gascolator is just too much into the slipstream of the scoop. any comments. Paul Burkhardt Date: Wed, 25 Dec 1996 22:47:37 -0800 From: sjm1@worldnet.att.net Subject: COZY: Carbon fiber plenum engine baffle system I have a Cozy MarkIV with a IO360C1C 200hp and have ordered a plenum carbon fiber engine baffle system from Velocity which they are using and similar to the one shown on the Lancair in December Sport Aviation magazine. Has any one else installed or have any suggestions regarding this. Stan Magill sjm1@worldnet.att.net Date: Thu, 26 Dec 1996 09:25:16 +0200 From: edegov@aztec.co.za (ernie de goveia) Subject: COZY: Re COZY Electronic Ignition Hi all Vance Atkinson described, in an article in Kit planes Sept 92, the fitting of electronic ignition to his cozy. He used an Electronic unit manufactured by Jeff Rose of Electro Air at phone, then 615/622-8825. Nat wrote in a news letter soon after, that Vance had dual electronic ignition on his airplane. Bob Nuckolls of the AeroElectric Connection, 6936 Bainbridge Rd, Wichita KS67226-1008. Wrote in Sport Aviation of Jan 94, Aug 95 and Dec 95 about a system controlling two batteries for dual electronic ignition, this may be worth checking out. Finally I think mags should be relegated to the past, what do you all think? Ernie de Goveia Cozy3 Ch 11 Date: 30 Dec 1996 11:23:52 -0800 From: "Judd Stewart" Subject: COZY: Re: COZY- Carbon fiber plenu RE>COZY: Carbon fiber plenum engine... 12/30/96 On subject of composite plenums, I've seen quite a few fiberglass installations, but my conservative side tells me it's not such a hot idea. Wouldn't you want to use a fire proof material in this area such as aluminum etc.? Judd