(Smail3.1.28.1 #7) id m0t4rQw-0004YyC; Mon, 16 Oct 95 10:26 CDT with Novell_GroupWise; Mon, 16 Oct 1995 10:26:16 -0500 Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 10:27:25 -0500 From: Scott Christensen Subject: long-ez repairs Over the weekend I looked at a damaged Long-EZ that a neighbor had just purchased. The plane has about 500 hours on it. Evidently someone had backed into the canard with a truck. The owner was not the builder, so he sold it rather than attempt to repair it. Unfortunately the guy that bought it has never built an airplane himself and is looking for guidance. (I am pre-build and have no composite experience so I am of limited help) The canard is at Beech Starship getting X-rayed to determine if it has internal damage. The tip of the canard has been crunched, as well as both ends of the elevator. The outboard tip from the truck, the inboard tip from being pushed into the side of the fuselage. The bulkhead where the canard bolts down is cracked. It appears as if the thickest fiberglass layup of the bulkhead (the most forward) did not crack, but the two layers of dense white foam and the two rearward fiberglass layups did. The bulkhead will slightly flex forward and rearward at this point. This is just above where the left leg goes through the bulkhead. On the left side, the nose cone is almost completely delaminated from the bulkhead down to the lower-left corner. It can be separated from the bulkhead at the top about 1/4 inch without applying excessive pressure. Other than this the nose cone has no damage. Behind this bulkhead on the left side, the fuselage sidewall was damaged and the inside layers of fiberglass were delaminated from the foam. The longeron was damaged, as well as the fiberglass area where the canard alignment pin protrudes. (I don?t have the plans for the names of this stuff) The neighbor had already cut this section of damage out and removed it before I saw the plane. He cut back to about four inches in front of the instrument panel bulkhead. A small amount of the fiberglass is still delaminated in front of the instrument panel bulkhead on the inside of the fuselage sidewall, but he is planning to inject flox/epoxy. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ After saying all of this, the fuselage itself appears to be fairly straight-forward to repair. I do not know how badly the canard was crunched (it was off at Beech). Someone had told him he may be able to inject flox/epoxy into the crack in the canard bulkhead rather than rip it out of there and replace it. What do you think??? Or would it be possible to remove just the section of the rear two layers of dense white foam along with the rear two layers of fiberglass layup around the area of the crack and replace it? Would you trust the X-ray on the canard or build a new one? Comments, suggestions?? Scott Date: Mon, 16 Oct 1995 12:49:00 -0400 From: Dick.Finn@FNB.sprint.com Subject: Re: long-ez repairs Scott It sounds as if your friend is going to have to purchase a significant amount of foam, glass, epoxy and hardware anyway. I would think that he'd be better off just throwing away the canard/elevators and starting from scratch. I know I'd feel more comfortable at 5,000 feet knowing that I had a solid canard. The canard and elevators would probably take him a couple of months work. There appears to me to be little structural value in the nose forward of the canard ( I could be wrong on that though) so I would probably proceed with a repair rather than a rebuild. The bulkhead could probably be repaired with multiple layups covering the crack. I would guess that a minimum of the same number required in the plans for that area would do the job. I did hear of a significant amount of discussion relating to making the top removeable just forward of the instrument panel and aft of the canard (for easy access). RAF maintains that that area is structural. Whatever your friend does he should probably contact RAF for their input. Good Luck, Dick Finn ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: long-ez repairs Author: SCHRISTE@intervoice.com at INTERNET Date: 10/16/95 11:34 AM Over the weekend I looked at a damaged Long-EZ that a neighbor had just purchased. The plane has about 500 hours on it. Evidently someone had backed into the canard with a truck. The owner was not the builder, so he sold it rather than attempt to repair it. Unfortunately the guy that bought it has never built an airplane himself and is looking for guidance. (I am pre-build and have no composite experience so I am of limited help) The canard is at Beech Starship getting X-rayed to determine if it has internal damage. The tip of the canard has been crunched, as well as both ends of the elevator. The outboard tip from the truck, the inboard tip from being pushed into the side of the fuselage. The bulkhead where the canard bolts down is cracked. It appears as if the thickest fiberglass layup of the bulkhead (the most forward) did not crack, but the two layers of dense white foam and the two rearward fiberglass layups did. The bulkhead will slightly flex forward and rearward at this point. This is just above where the left leg goes through the bulkhead. On the left side, the nose cone is almost completely delaminated from the bulkhead down to the lower-left corner. It can be separated from the bulkhead at the top about 1/4 inch without applying excessive pressure. Other than this the nose cone has no damage. Behind this bulkhead on the left side, the fuselage sidewall was damaged and the inside layers of fiberglass were delaminated from the foam. The longeron was damaged, as well as the fiberglass area where the canard alignment pin protrudes. (I don?t have the plans for the names of this stuff) The neighbor had already cut this section of damage out and removed it before I saw the plane. He cut back to about four inches in front of the instrument panel bulkhead. A small amount of the fiberglass is still delaminated in front of the instrument panel bulkhead on the inside of the fuselage sidewall, but he is planning to inject flox/epoxy. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ After saying all of this, the fuselage itself appears to be fairly straight-forward to repair. I do not know how badly the canard was crunched (it was off at Beech). Someone had told him he may be able to inject flox/epoxy into the crack in the canard bulkhead rather than rip it out of there and replace it. What do you think??? Or would it be possible to remove just the section of the rear two layers of dense white foam along with the rear two layers of fiberglass layup around the area of the crack and replace it? Would you trust the X-ray on the canard or build a new one? Comments, suggestions?? Scott Date: Tue, 17 Oct 1995 12:23:34 -0600 From: reavesga@iamerica.net (Geroge Reaves) Subject: Long EZ Repair Hello I am considering building a Cozy, however, I was at a local airport the other day and found a Long-EZ in the corner of the maintance hanger that appears to be forgotten. In checking around that is the case. The A&P there says the guy left it about a year ago and thay have not herd from him since. The A&P is willing to just get rid of it. I am trying to figure out the legals on it right now, but before I get to enthusiastic. The canard area is showing several surface cracks. Also there seems to be a large crack in the wing area between the forward strake and the rear main wing. It appears this crack may be some kind of joint as it is very well defined on both sides of the aircraft. The fuselage appears to be ok, with no major problems as does the motor mount area. I am looking for comments from the net so that I can determin if the aircraft is worth repairing. Also, where can I purchase a set of plans for this aircraft ?? Thanks for the help George Reaves reavesga@iamerica.net David Allsop Cheif Engineer Kestrel Aircraft From: Marc J. Zeitlin Subject: Long EZ Repair (fwd) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 14:31:24 EDT George Reaves writes: > I am considering building a Cozy, however, I was at a local >airport the other day and found a Long-EZ in the corner of the >maintance hanger.......... > The canard area is showing several surface cracks. May or may not be important. > ............. Also there >seems to be a large crack in the wing area between the forward strake >and the rear main wing. It appears this crack may be some kind of >joint as it is very well defined on both sides of the aircraft. Yeah, thats the wing-strake joint - all the Rutan derivatives look like that. Most people fill that with silicone rubber. > I am looking for comments from the net so that I can determine >if the aircraft is worth repairing. Here's my $0.02. Having built 1 1/2 composite aircraft and knowing what goes inside them, I would NEVER buy a composite plane unless I met the builder, trusted him, and read the builder's logbook CAREFULLY. Since you can't look "inside" the structure, and since the cosmetics of the outside surface tell you NOTHING about the structural integrity of the plane, you don't know anything about how well this plane was built. You don't even know if it flew, or how well if it did. I would not be willing to trust MY life to an unknown plane. >............ Also, where can I purchase a set >of plans for this aircraft ?? There's a guy named "David Orr", I believe (his address and phone # were in the latest issue of the Central States Newsletter) who deals in VE and LE plans. The LE builders on this mailing list might be able to help you out here as well. Good luck. -- Marc J. Zeitlin Email: marcz@an.hp.com Date: Tue, 17 Oct 95 15:33:08 EDT From: "Nick J Ugolini" Subject: re: Long EZ Repair George, You will learn a tremendous amount by building your own aircraft, and the strenghts and weaknesses (and repair) of composite construction. There is no way of knowing how the previous owner built or cared for the plane. There has been cases of structual failure caused by a builder leaving peel-ply in the layups (which caused delamination) and the need to rebuild the wings. Buying someone else work leaves you with a lot of uncertainty about a vehicle you are trusting your own and your love ones lives in. Besides, the real joy and pride of owning a homebuilt is that YOU have built something that is special, something few others could duplicate. If the price is right buy it for the parts, and build your own airframe. Create your own mark in history..... U. Nick